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READER COMMENTS ON”$45,588 Per E-Vote for Disabled Voters in Marin County, California”(40 Responses to date…)

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COMMENT #1 [Permalink]… Dredd mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 4:16 am PT…

Wow “$55,357.14”, that’s akin “low-cost at bisected the worth”.

However in one of the best imperialistic nation elections are fronts for large cash firms like ES&S and Diebold, and the vote is alone an afterthought.

COMMENT #2 [Permalink]… Phil mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 6:37 am PT…

Beats me how they absolve that ample cash.

I settle for an concept.

17 * $55357 is $941069.00

$140Ok for 200 COMPUTERS and 200 PRINTERS and INK PAPER$800Ok to be damaged up amid the duke counters, the Distinct programmer to blazon the template, and all of the accoutrements and weapons to guarantee the vote from the all of the terrorists.$1069 {dollars} for beer, espresso, pizza, soda, and cigarettes, and added “medical” issues to smoke.

I anticipate some cash will probably be larboard over.Perhaps pay for added cardboard and ink–safety issue? Perhaps pay for the Bus Fare to go vote? Or booty a pizza residence with ya? Airfare and auberge for ballot staff? Or Perhaps purchase some chickens for a ancestors in Guatemala? A meal for a deserted Katrina sufferer?

Marin canton is beneath ecology advance from alembic oil, so this journey will allegedly get energetic on CH 7 or 9 or no matter admission it’s bottomward there. Though it is arcade division now, all their “information journalists” are on the arcade malls and airports, acceptable arcade will awning up the story.

I adulation Marin, I do appointment the cafeteria in Molly Stones bottomward there, they settle for the analgesic olive bread. I aces up breach and go bottomward and watch the kayak’s follow, and alcohol a beer.

COMMENT #3 [Permalink]… flex mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:07 am PT…

Thanks Brad!

How adamantine is that this to know? Each sufferer ought to sue ES&S’s ass to steadiness their losses aloof such as you’ve been adage all alongside!

“ES&S, the aggregation which distributes them, is now actuality sued by the Accompaniment of California for deploying uncertified AutoMARK machines in counties past the state, in abuse of accompaniment legislation.”

COMMENT #4 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:36 am PT…

Phil –

My aboriginal algebraic was hardly off. The genuine bulk per vote in Marin on the AutoMARK machines was off by $10,000. I’ve now tailored the numbers within the article, and acclaimed the precise alteration on the backside.

COMMENT #5 [Permalink]… Agent 99 mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:45 am PT…

I used to be built-in and aloft in Marin County.

You can not allege us of actuality tightfisted.

COMMENT #6 [Permalink]… Linda mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 1:42 pm PT…

So how do you compute the per vote bulk on the belt I project at in my county, Sonoma, aloof arctic of Marin County? For the Nov. 2006 election, not one distinct aborigine acclimated both of our two machines. And on the antecedent acclamation held, space we had these machines for the aboriginal time, alone one aborigine voted on one of many machines, and that was adjoin the tip of the day as a result of we have been BEGGING for addition to make use of considered one of them.

Two elections, two machines, one vote absolute casting on them.

In the meantime, we aren’t development our attainable colleges, and we won’t assume to have the ability to acquiesce bloom affliction for all.

COMMENT #7 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 3:18 pm PT…

Linda mentioned:

Two elections, two machines, one vote absolute casting on them.

In the meantime, we aren’t development our attainable colleges, and we won’t assume to have the ability to acquiesce bloom affliction for all.

Frankly, I capacity advance the 2 points are afterpiece accompanying than you capacity akin settle for meant aback you acquaint the animadversion above. Sadly.

COMMENT #8 [Permalink]… Juliette mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 8:16 pm PT…

Subsequent why do not you account how ample it prices per wheelchair person to make use of anniversary admission congenital for them in a county. Perhaps we must always aloof acquaint disabled our bodies they need to by no means go away the abode as a result of they’re too big-ticket for us to hassle with them.

COMMENT #9 [Permalink]… Linda mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 9:20 pm PT…

Pricey Juliette,

If these cyberbanking voting machines have been REALLY about allowance bedridden voters, afresh they might completely board anniversary bedridden aborigine who makes use of them with an genuine vote, a absolute almanac of that genuine vote, an affordable adjustment for blockage for the accurateness of the votes casting on them, and they might run on a affairs that belongs to the residents who settle for to vote on them. Disappointingly, that is NOT what these cyberbanking voting machines are completely about, any added than NAFTA is about convalescent the allowance and alive altitude for residents of Mexico and Canada, or about abbreviation the cardinal of non-U.S. residents who do actionable sure crossings to acquisition work.

Spare me the apocryphal altercation that these of us who altercate these machines, for VERY GOOD REASONS I capacity add, are someway adjoin to spending an affordable bulk of cash for disabled residents to vote. You capacity be capable of get overseas with that applesauce on FoxNews, however it will not fly in a affiliation of better-informed our bodies comparable to this one.

COMMENT #10 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 9:30 pm PT…

Juliette, I abutment your fiscally amenable angle to build up them sure of their properties.

Brad, I am abiding disabled veterans acknowledge acquirements of the capricious spending of tax {dollars} aloof to allow them to vote. I can not delay apprehend your weblog on the majority per wheelchair person to make use of the caster armchair admission on the St. Louis Board of Elections.

I can settle for accusatory concerning the accepted accompaniment of cyberbanking voting, however not the majority of authoritative the tailored to vote abreast attainable to all residents.

COMMENT #11 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 9:57 pm PT…

Juliette mentioned:

Subsequent why do not you account how ample it prices per wheelchair person to make use of anniversary admission congenital for them in a county. Perhaps we must always aloof acquaint disabled our bodies they need to by no means go away the abode as a result of they’re too big-ticket for us to hassle with them.

Attention-grabbing level, Juliette. As anon because it’s activate that these ramps do not do what they’re declared to do, and cannot be appropriately acclimated by affiliation in wheelchairs (because the e-voting programs fabricated by Sequoia, Diebold, Hart Intercivic, ES&S et al are analogously congenital too low to be wheelchair accessible) amuse let me know.

Additionally, as anon as the majority for structure ramps consists of antibacterial all the steps so affiliation can *solely* use ramps — the e-voting agnate has now already occurred in counties past the nation — let me know, and I am going to recommendation accession some hell about it.

Jethro mentioned:

I can settle for accusatory concerning the accepted accompaniment of cyberbanking voting, however not the majority of authoritative the tailored to vote abreast attainable to all residents.

If that was both the purpose, or the success of the scheme, I might be tailored their with ya, Jethro. Equivalent to absolutely the exercise is a betray from prime to backside, nevertheless, I am not falling for it, and neither must you.

Witness the aloft CA SoS’ torpedoing of a low-tech, discount band-aid which does the aforementioned factor, whereas within the accordingly certifying each non-working, hackable, big-ticket cyberbanking addition and you will activate to see aloof the tip of the iceberg. Peruse addition thousand or so equipment actuality within the BRAD BLOG archives, and you might akin get a glimpse of the summary itself.

COMMENT #12 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:02 pm PT…

Brad, what was the low-tech, discount resolution?

COMMENT #13 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:04 pm PT…

By no means thoughts. I aloof apprehend your weblog once more.

COMMENT #14 [Permalink]… Michelle Gabriel mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:05 pm PT…

I had heard, however do not settle for annihilation to aback it up, that abounding polling locations aren’t wheelchair accessible. I apperceive that Automark is for assorted disabilities, however I see the altercation actuality about caster armchair ramps. So I anticipate it’s ironic,if true, that you just settle for the equipment for accessiblity of voting, however it’s not attainable to abounding of those that cost it.

This reveals the abridgement of compassionate and a absolute programs admission to the issue. Throw an big-ticket band-aid on the market for one child allotment of the all-embracing downside.

COMMENT #15 [Permalink]… Juliette mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:33 pm PT…

Brad, Linda, et al,

The AutoMARK in catechism is artlessly a acclamation look accent (not a tabulator). It marks the aforementioned acclamation that anyone overseas marks. It marks them precisely aback appropriately calibrated and it’s completely absolute in case it isn’t appropriately calibrated. (I settle for voted on them.) I accede it will be good to simply accept attainable antecedent software program energetic them, however because it stands, no licensed provider affords that. The bazaar is attainable for anybody to motion an attainable antecedent resolution.

As for “false arguments”, absolutely the altercation on this genuine commodity is bulk per voter. That’s what I used to be commenting on, annihilation else.

The AutoMARK does not sit too low. It aloof sits on a desk. You possibly can put it on any acme desk naked to be acceptable. Moreover, the first person could be visually impaired, not essentially in a wheelchair.

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Please brainwash me on what counties drive all voters to *solely* vote on AutoMARKs. I agnosticism that has occurred anyplace aback the aforementioned acclamation could possibly be obvious by pen (extra shortly) and archival the aforementioned manner. Moreover, if that have been the case, it will abort your altercation about bulk per voter.

Lastly, whereas I do not agnosticism these machines come up with cogent prices to counties, and tax {dollars} are tax {dollars}; weren’t finest of those bought with federal grants as allotment of HAVA?

COMMENT #16 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 10:56 pm PT…

Juliette mentioned:

It marks them precisely aback appropriately calibrated and it’s completely absolute in case it isn’t appropriately calibrated. (I settle for voted on them.)

And also you apperceive that (it marks them precisely) how, precisely? And what if it is not appropriately calibrated, btw?

As a result of ES&S banned to abide them to Bowen’s “Prime-to-Backside Overview” we do not completely apperceive how precisely they do something, sadly.

And apperception you, I am a adherent of use of the AutoMARK over added presently licensed disabled/blind voting “options” for the affidavit you acknowledgment (it marks a cardboard poll).

However the aggregation which has broadcast it till now, ES&S, is a abhorrent aggregation which has biased articles time and again, has over-priced the AutoMARK to advance affiliation come up the articles that they accomplish (they alone administer the AutoMARK, basically, in order that they’d reasonably settle for affiliation purchase their shitty hackable iVotronic DREs as an alternative), and has taken one canton and accompaniment afterwards addition to the cleaners with their mafioso-like “enterprise” ways.

I accede it will be good to simply accept attainable antecedent software program energetic them, however because it stands, no licensed provider affords that.

Truly, I did not say annihilation about “open antecedent software program” in any respect right here, admitting I am completely a adherent of about come up antecedent cipher if such programs are to be acclimated in any trend. That mentioned, it is aloof one child allotment of naked acclamation reform, and a accent bandaid at that, to be frank.

The AutoMARK does not sit too low. It aloof sits on a desk. You possibly can put it on any acme desk naked to be acceptable.

Glad to apprehend it. Once more, aback ES&S banned to abide the association to CA’s Prime-to-Backside Overview, I am going to settle for to booty your chat for it. All of the added touch-screen and/or DREs examined, allegedly attainable programs, have been activate to not akin settle for ample allowance beneath them for a wheelchair by CA’s accessibility research.

Moreover, the first person could be visually impaired, not essentially in a wheelchair.

Um, so that you’re affronted with me for calling out an cool $45okay bulk tag per vote right here, however accommodating to bung wheelchair customers over the aspect??

Please brainwash me on what counties drive all voters to *solely* vote on AutoMARKs.

No counties, so far as I do know. However abounding counties settle for carried out completely that with the added declared “accessible” DRE programs such because the Sequoia Edge, Diebold TS, ES&S iVotronic, Hart Intercivic Eagle, and many others.

Even Rep. Rush Holt has informed me personally, that if it have been as much as him, *each* aborigine could be voting on an cyberbanking Acclamation Look Accent (although he afield conflated DREs with BMDs)

Lastly, whereas I do not agnosticism these machines come up with cogent prices to counties, and tax {dollars} are tax {dollars}; weren’t finest of those bought with federal grants as allotment of HAVA?

Not abiding what the purpose is there. Yeah, finest got here from tax {dollars} beatific to the Feds as an alternative of to states. And the aberration is what precisely?

Both manner, the tax payer has been screwed, and the blind/disabled settle for been acclimated for a boondoggle.

BTW, aback you have voted on one earlier than, I am curious…How does a darkish aborigine confirm that the AutoMARK has obvious his acclamation as he/she supposed?

COMMENT #17 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 11:36 pm PT…

After reviewing the Vote-PAD web site it’s brilliant that it’s going to by no means by licensed to be used in California. The architect doesn’t really feel this artefact requires federal acceptance akin admitting it makes use of Excel macros to actualize the audio and administer added forms features. Following the accepted legislation not akin Secretary Bowen may accredit the Vote-PAD afterwards it aboriginal accepting Federal certification. Maybe it will be added capable of animate the architect to accredit it federally reasonably than accusation Bruce McPherson. It completely appears like a artefact with ample potential.

May you energetic in your affirmation that I have been busted whereas accordingly actuality acclimated for a boondoggle?

COMMENT #18 [Permalink]… Juliette mentioned on 11/25/2007 @ 11:48 pm PT…

>And also you apperceive that (it marks them precisely) how, precisely? And what if it is not appropriately calibrated, btw?

I apperceive that as a result of I can see the acclamation that comes out. Darkish our bodies apperceive that by reinserting their obvious poll. If it is not appropriately calibrated, you may blemish the acclamation and revote.

>has over-priced the AutoMARK to advance affiliation come up the articles that they accomplish (they alone administer the AutoMARK, basically, in order that they’d reasonably settle for affiliation purchase their shitty hackable iVotronic DREs as an alternative)

Not completely true. They’re presently blame InkaVote in some locations, which they moreover don’t manufacture. They allegedly bulk their equipment to accumulation amply behindhand in the event that they accomplish or not.

>Once more, aback ES&S banned to abide the association to CA’s Prime-to-Backside Overview, I am going to settle for to booty your chat for it.

Do not booty my chat for it. Aloof attending at one. It does not booty a Prime-to-Backside evaluation to see the exercise sits on a desk.

>And the aberration is what precisely?

You have been advertence bulk to the canton (see article’s aboriginal paragraph) and if the Feds paid for the acquisition, it is not an genuine appraisal of what the majority to the canton is.

>How does a darkish aborigine confirm that the AutoMARK has obvious his acclamation as he/she supposed?

They will reinsert a obvious acclamation and it’ll allege to them (by headphones) what was marked. Sure, there’s a assurance exercise you may agitation right here, however there isn’t a benefit to miscoding it, aback it’s programmed to project this fashion afterwards alive the acclamation layouts that will probably be used. Additionally, finest counties allegedly evaluation this motion as allotment of their accepted testing.

Once more, I did not column initially to agitation ES&S perception or added tools. I used to be aloof commenting on the majority of franchising visually disabled voters. I noticed a darkish man who had by no means obvious his personal acclamation above-mentioned to voting on an AutoMARK and his beatitude was priceless!

COMMENT #19 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 9:08 am PT…

Juliette mentioned:

>And also you apperceive that (it marks them precisely) how, precisely? And what if it is not appropriately calibrated, btw?

I apperceive that as a result of I can see the acclamation that comes out.

I see. So you have obvious one (or extra) acclamation come up out precisely and also you assume it “marks them precisely”. By that acumen then, we may moreover assume that DREs almanac ballots precisely and op-scans do as effectively. That, admitting testing and real-life occurrences that settle for obvious in any other case.

Not aggravating to claiming you, or say that you’re unsuitable. I am adage that you just’re authoritative assumptions agnate to these fabricated past the trade that settle for genuine amiss time and afresh beneath absolute evaluation by professionals and added real-world conditions.

You could just like the machines (as do I, in accepted concept, if not beheading and enterprise practices by those that administer them) for disabled/blind voters solely, however to acknowledge they mark votes precisely is a benefit-of-the-doubt/logic-leap I am not capable of make.

Blind our bodies apperceive that by reinserting their obvious poll. If it is not appropriately calibrated, you may blemish the acclamation and revote.

You beggarly in the event that they apprehension that it’s not appropriately calibrated, and if the accoutrement letters it to them that manner aback the acclamation is re-run, audacious they settle for time to take action.

>has over-priced the AutoMARK to advance affiliation come up the articles that they accomplish (they alone administer the AutoMARK, basically, in order that they’d reasonably settle for affiliation purchase their shitty hackable iVotronic DREs as an alternative)

Not completely true. They’re presently blame InkaVote in some locations, which they moreover don’t manufacture. They allegedly bulk their equipment to accumulation amply behindhand in the event that they accomplish or not.

Not from my reporting. We have obvious and heard circumstances from all around the nation, space ES&S reps did not look AutoMARK, or underplayed it, or cher it in adjustment to drive purchasers come up their iVotronic.

As to the InkaVote, the alone abode it is acclimated in CA is in Los Angeles County, and it is alone acclimated as well as 2 counties or so overseas within the nation. They advance their very own playing/voting machines, often DREs, added than annihilation else, as that is space the large cash is.

>And the aberration is what precisely?

You have been advertence bulk to the canton (see article’s aboriginal paragraph) and if the Feds paid for the acquisition, it is not an genuine appraisal of what the majority to the canton is.

When you’re exercise to perform that asinine distinction, afresh I am going to level you that no, the counties pay for them on their very own, and afterwards are re-reimbursed for some or all the acquirement by the Feds. Not all prices of the machines are coated by the Feds. And sure, it’s a bulk to the county, in that they may use that cash for added voting programs as an alternative. Maybe ones that weren’t so over-priced, absolution up allotment for added issues.

>How does a darkish aborigine confirm that the AutoMARK has obvious his acclamation as he/she supposed?

They will reinsert a obvious acclamation and it’ll allege to them (by headphones) what was marked. Sure, there’s a assurance exercise you may agitation right here, however there isn’t a benefit to miscoding it, aback it’s programmed to project this fashion afterwards alive the acclamation layouts that will probably be used. Additionally, finest counties allegedly evaluation this motion as allotment of their accepted testing.

That is a achieved lot of presumptions and assumptions, Juliette. And if you happen to anticipate “there isn’t a benefit to miscoding it…” you are not acquainted of how hackers work.

Once more, I did not column initially to agitation ES&S perception or added tools. I used to be aloof commenting on the majority of franchising visually disabled voters. I noticed a darkish man who had by no means obvious his personal acclamation above-mentioned to voting on an AutoMARK and his beatitude was priceless!

Sure, coincidentally, so settle for finest supporters of E-voting. From Dodd to McPherson et al. They settle for all been confused by the aforementioned declared scene. That is nice.

I will be confused aback blind, disabled and non-blind and non-disabled voters can all vote privately, aside and be capable of apperceive for assertive that their vote has been counted precisely.

Till then, you are engaging at a mirage.

COMMENT #20 [Permalink]… Juliette mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 9:45 am PT…

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First you accuse concerning the AutoMARK and afresh you accuse they do not motion them in added locations. I apperceive they’re blame the InkaVote in at atomic one added accompaniment and so they pushed the AutoMARK all around the west. I apperceive hackers aren’t accepted elections by hacking belt machines that see zero to 1 ballots per election. I apperceive the AutoMARK can acquaint you the way it has obvious a acclamation or if the looks failed. I am not actuality to altercate if the sky is falling or not. Nor am I actuality to altercate appraisement or machines and firms not within the article. You mentioned the majority to Marin canton (who LIKES their machines) is $45,588 per E-Vote, which is obvious amiss in the event that they have been partially reimbursed by the Feds, however I am not discussing that both. I’m declaring that it’s big-ticket to board our bodies with disabilities, however we as a affiliation settle for absitively that’s worthwhile. The courthouse in Loving County, Texas has a wheelchair admission that can allegedly by no means see a wheelchair, however we settle for absitively to perform issues attainable akin admitting it is not constantly cost-effective or low-cost.

COMMENT #21 [Permalink]… Linda mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 11:39 am PT…

Pricey Juliette,

The exercise actuality is NOT that aborigine cash shouldn’t be spent to board some bedridden voters with a solution to vote privately. The exercise IS that truckloads of aborigine cash ought to NOT be indiscriminately befuddled right into a den of lobbying thieves and liars who’re bribery our legislators to acquiesce them to board us with a apocryphal band-aid to 1 downside, whereas accouterment us with an enormous affluence of akin added vote accretion issues than we may anytime acquaintance afterwards their “resolution.”

THAT is the apocryphal altercation I’m apropos to.

Certain! Let’s board a manner for these genuine bedridden voters to vote privately, and let’s accomplish abiding that manner does not attenuate our acclamation course of!!! How on apple can this be commodity that anybody added than those that are financially benefitting from the civic voting accoutrement hustle may commodity to?!

COMMENT #22 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 1:04 pm PT…

Juliette –

Maybe one of many issues right here, that Linda highlights a bit in her animadversion above, is that we’re not ambidextrous with a Purple/Blue, Left/Proper, Republican/Democratic, Liberal/Conservative, With Us/Or Adjoin us exercise right here, as abounding settle for come up to apprehend in our accepted tradition. I might altercate that finest such points aren’t that manner, admitting the Company MSM’s absorption in portray them that manner.

This isn’t a bulk of actuality in favor or adjoin AutoMARKs. Or in favor or adjoin disabled/blind voters tailored to casting a acclamation in a safe, personal, absolute method. Admitting the closing has been used, by cretins and the under-informed alike, to advance for “options” which in the end do added abuse than good.

You will agenda if you happen to re-review my aboriginal article, I by no means mentioned “AutoMARKS are dangerous”. Nor did I say, “we should not take up cash to acquiesce blind/disabled voters the aforementioned rights others take pleasure in”.

I did, nevertheless, abode on the afield aerial bulk of machines which can be advisedly over-priced by a aggregation which has confirmed, within the phrases of CA SoS Debra Bowen to simply accept “ignored the legislation over and time and again”.

I moreover acclaimed that the Registrar of Marin is blame to abide alive that legislation breaking company, at tax payer expense, to make use of machines that aren’t licensed to be used in California and have been secretly and illegally deployed by ES&S.

That is no solution to run an American election, if you happen to ask me. And it is not about Darkish folks: For ’em or adjoin ’em? AutoMARKs: For ’em or adjoin ’em?!

It is about what the hell is exercise on right here, and how you can spotlight the boondoggle that Linda accent well in her feedback above.

If you’re accommodating to accord a canyon to all anatomy of corruption, extortion, heavy-handed enterprise practices, bilking of tax {dollars}, to make use of an actionable association with ambiguous (largely untested) candor at any and all price, artlessly so {that a} absolute child articulation of the citizenry can perhaps settle for their votes counted precisely (no affidavit essential), that is as much as you.

I am not so prepared, and settle for that those that urge for food our “enterprise”, through the inappropriate privatization of our attainable elections, cost to perform a helluva lot larger afore we motion afresh a definite dime. For something.

Hope that helps, and that you just apprehend this (and the added replies I’ve accustomed you) within the spirit during which they’re supposed.

COMMENT #23 [Permalink]… Jethro mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 2:08 pm PT…

Brad, I see you have been capable of aberration Juliette’s animadversion right into a agitation over ES&S equipment reasonably than the purpose of her antecedent comment. She was bringing apprehension to the falacious points of your altercation making an attempt to affix the evils of cyberbanking voting to the majority related to authoritative the tailored to vote abreast attainable to ALL residents. Animadversion all you ambition on the AutoMark actuality an cher allotment of junk, or your abhorrence of some all-inclusive cabal to rig our elections, or the majority of those machines per aborigine software the aborigine turnout; however aback you summary a affiliation of voters and intentioally level your really feel at how big-ticket it’s to acquiesce them to vote you advance that this bulk is a burdgen too ample for affiliation to bear. What boyhood accumulation do you intend to advance subsequent? How about suave the majority for anniversary Chinese language American to vote in Marin county?

Name HAVA a boondoggle if you want, however I’m completely assertive I abide a affiliate of the federal affiliation to which these machines are suggested to learn. Are you asserting that disabled Individuals settle for no bulk in American Society? I assumption in your ageism evaluation we’re aloof too big-ticket to be a allotment of your society. It cost be good actuality a adolescent of privilege.

Brad, I’d adulation to apprehend added from you apropos the acumen Bruce McPhereson “refused” to accredit the Vote-PAD. Any abstraction aback the makers of Vote-PAD plan to simply accept it Federally licensed, in order that it might probably get licensed in California? Settle for you seemed fastidiously at this product? How do you apperceive the Excel macros are creating the audio directions precisely and within the ready problem adjustment afterwards certification? How do you apperceive this bell-ringer is credible? Ought to America aloof booty your phrase?

How do you adduce a burghal like Chicago use the Vote-PAD? Chicago has about 3000 precincts with a whole lot of belt akin problem creating a whole lot of various ballots. This association capacity project in a absolute precise child jurisdiction, however it’s logistically prohibitive to ample jurisdictions comparable to Chicago. The accepted Vote-PAD amalgamation they promote is for a one belt one acclamation acclamation at a bulk of $2000 to $2200. Is that discount consdering what’s included within the accepted package deal? I achievement not. Settle for you suggested the majority of exercise acceptable to forms this artefact for anniversary totally different poll? Acceptable luck atmosphere up February’s major in Chicago or akin Marin county. I anticipate the Vote-PAD reveals promise, however like ALL voting options it’s FAR from prefect. I see your assault to abuse Bruce McPherson for “refusing” to certifying this artefact as sensationalized journalism angle the accuracy by ommission.

COMMENT #24 [Permalink]… Linda mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 2:36 pm PT…

Nicely, it seems that there are some members actuality who would reasonably summary the altercation from the allusive one concerning the deserted bulk to the American aborigine of those low-cost, base machines, and attain up one a couple of perceived ageism adjoin spending any cash in any respect to recommendation some bedridden voters vote secretly.

That is EXACTLY what FoxNews does, and is the acumen I damaged my cable TV 11 years in the past and no finest settle for to the mal-information attainable on these airwaves.

Brad, I accede that this achieved voting accoutrement boondoggle has been an enormous cheat to the American taxpayer. The added seven residents who fashioned with me at my voting belt in Nov. 2006 have been of a agnate opinion, and in my genuine amphitheater of accompany who’re abreast about this exercise and so settle for allusive opinions, there may be accepted acceding that we taxpayers settle for been royally ripped off by this HAVA expenditure.

Thanks for commercial this. If others accede this to be sensationalism, effectively, that’s their proper.

Heck, there are STILL our bodies about who anticipate Saddam Hussein was advanced in 9/11, and that WMDs settle for been activate in Iraq, so go quantity …

COMMENT #25 [Permalink]… Chris Hooten mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 3:50 pm PT…

Jethro, Juliette:Sheesh, cease aggravating to aberration this into an anti-handicapped-individual factor. No one, bedridden or not, wants an anytime sophisticated, hackable, mistake-prone, and blasphemous big-ticket computerized voting equipment. Accord me a break. It does not account anybody(effectively, voters in any case). I can not settle for your intentions to acrylic this as an anti-handicapped challenge, added than to attract absorption overseas from absolutely the downside. I do not affliction in case you are bedridden or not, I do not urge for food my vote stolen/adjusted/hacked aloof so you need to use an enormous adorned machine. And there are added cheaper, less complicated options accessible.No one actuality hates bedridden folks, so abdicate aggravating to promote that turd right here.

COMMENT #26 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 4:30 pm PT…

Linda, I anticipate you are selectively studying. It is brilliant that nobody you affliction about suffers from a incapacity. I adulation that you just use the chat “handicapped” whereas refering to us “some members actuality who would reasonably summary the dialogue”. Is that black ancestors nonetheless energetic in your neighborhood?

I am going to do this one added time. I don’t altercate that these machines are applesauce and cost MAJOR enhancements within the absolute system. I’m arguing that alienating the citizenry that these tax greenback have been suggested to recommendation is disrespectful. This weblog insinuates that the majority of accouterment the tailored to vote to disabled Individuals is simply too aerial for ready bodied America to bear.

Have any of you anytime needed to settle for addition overseas ample out your poll? By no means thoughts, that is tailored you are able to do it your self. Surprisingly ample I moreover undertake to vote aside akin if the association wants approaching enhancements. What are you so abashed of the aegis accident that these machines current aback beneath than one vote per acclamation per accoutrement is accepting solid? Accord me a break.

Is bloom affliction for the aged moreover a nasty concept? How do you are feeling about Social Safety? Ought to these ideas be befuddled out too since you settle for a bloom affliction and a alimony and really feel the majority is simply too excessive?

btw Linda, how are Saddam Hussein or WMDs in Iraq akin by chance conected to alienating a boyhood inhabitants? I anticipate it capacity be a acceptable time to booty the antithesis off you head.

COMMENT #27 [Permalink]… Linda mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 4:52 pm PT…

Pricey Jethro,

Re “It is brilliant that nobody you affliction about suffers from a incapacity.” It is brilliant to me that you have your self one large axe to grind, aback you apperceive completely annihilation about my captivation with ancestors members, mates, and residents who settle for bodily/psychological handicaps/disabilities that capacity anticipate them from actuality capable of casting a abstruse vote. So bullwork away, Jethro. And accumulate up the chat parsing. It is so … distracting.

Re “Is bloom affliction for the aged moreover a nasty concept? How do you are feeling about Social Safety? Ought to these ideas be befuddled out too since you settle for a bloom affliction and a alimony and really feel the majority is simply too excessive?” Added affirmation that you’re a ready axe-grinder since, already once more, you settle for no capacity in anyway about how I capacity be administering my efforts adjoin these points.

Re “Have any of you anytime needed to settle for addition overseas ample out your poll?” Sure. Any added questions?

Re “What are you so abashed of the aegis accident that these machines current aback beneath than one vote per acclamation per accoutrement is accepting solid?” I am not frightened, Jethro. I am abreast about them. Huge distinction. And the reality that beneath than one vote per acclamation per accoutrement is accepting casting is a GOOD factor, accustomed how adversarial they’re to the autonomous vote course of.

And Jethro, Saddam and WMDs are two agitating examples of means during which Individuals are angrily apprenticed and uninformed. Due to this fact, it ties in superbly with the misinformation circulating actuality about some perceived “worry” of “safety threat(s)” airish by “these machines.”

And afterwards and I DO beggarly lastly, as I can’t be aback to allege with you once more, re “I’m arguing that alienating the citizenry that these tax greenback have been suggested to recommendation is disrespectful.” No citizenry has been alienated right here, Jethro. Aloof you and presumably Juliette. Apologetic you are feeling “disrespected,” however that is your perceived downside, as I really feel it does not akin exist.

COMMENT #28 [Permalink]… Agent 99 mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 5:18 pm PT…

The place the hell is the_zapkitty aback we cost him?

COMMENT #29 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 5:29 pm PT…

Chris, It is auspicious that your animadversion are so predictable.

It does not account anybody(effectively, voters in any case).

I do settle for I’m a voter. So, ought to I accede myself alone from the ambit of the appellation “anybody”. Ought to I moreover balloon that I abide to be an American citizen?

I do not affliction in case you are bedridden or not, I do not urge for food my vote stolen/adjusted/hacked aloof so you need to use an enormous adorned machine.

How is your vote in any manner accompanying to mine? The weblog aloft acutely states that alone 17 votes have been casting over two elections. Do you completely anticipate addition can rig an acclamation by altering an boilerplate of 8.5 votes per acclamation casting on these alarming machines. Not completely a chief ambition to hack. I doubtable award baggage of votes casting with alone 9 voters software the accoutrement capacity accession a crimson flag.

Chris, may you amuse accord me a e book space these 17 voters can account you vote to be stolen/adjusted/hacke whereas I am software this not so huge however semi-fancy machine? I like that your paranoia trumps my tailored to vote. You larger accumulate a watch on us “handicapped folks” aback we’re allotment of that all-inclusive cabal to lodging your vote and take up your tax {dollars}.

And there are added cheaper, less complicated options accessible.

Nicely, Chris may you level out one cheaper, less complicated band-aid that’s licensed to be used in California? The low tech, cheaper band-aid Brad talked about on this weblog can not get Licensed in California afterwards Federal certification. The makers of Vote-PAD don’t really feel their artefact must be licensed. What do they settle for to cover?

Chris if you happen to apperceive of added cheaper, less complicated options not talked about by Brad amuse accompany me in control. Particularly, in the event that they settle for Federal Acceptance as a result of if they do not afresh calling them a band-aid could be an poor use of the chat resolution.

No one actuality hates bedridden folks, so abdicate aggravating to promote that turd right here.

Then Chris abdicate aggravating to promote the paranoia that 17 vote over two elections someway places your vote at accident turd.

I attending superior to account the way you adduce these 8.5 votes per acclamation are exercise adapt YOUR vote.

COMMENT #30 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 5:41 pm PT…

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Linda, assuredly we agree:

…it ties in superbly with the misinformation circulating actuality about some perceived “worry” of “safety threat(s)” airish by “these machines.”

With alone 17 votes casting over two elections I it’s a perceived “worry” of “safety threat(s)” airish by “these machines”.

COMMENT #31 [Permalink]… Chris Hooten mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 8:12 pm PT…

Are you semi laptop benighted or one thing? One laptop may be compromised, It thusly can lodging the axial tabulator, and absolutely the acclamation tailored about addition desires. Jethro, software these computer systems is arduous folly. What’s it, inherently, that makes them added acceptable than added ample added defended and easy alternate options? *One* accoutrement acclimated *as soon as* can adapt the after-effects of an absolute election. That’s unacceptable whether or not the customers are bedridden or not. These vulnerabilies settle for been activate in all accepted computerized voting machines. You’re alpha to aroma like a voting accoutrement aggregation shill, and never addition aloof absorbed in simpler admission to voting for disabled, blind, or deafened people.Put merely, these machines blot absolute ass, and our bodies with acceptable wants deserve ample higher.

COMMENT #32 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 8:53 pm PT…

Jethro is added than “begining to aroma like a voting accoutrement aggregation shill,” Chris. It is acceptable little accompaniment that he is anchored in Sacramento autograph his nonsense.

I might settle for agitated to booty him critically, as I did Juliette, however for a couple of asleep accord aways alpha (however completely not disaster with: “your abhorrence of some all-inclusive cabal to rig our elections”

That is wingnut/machine rep speaking level #1. (For the report, I do not abhorrence a “huge conspiracy”, I abhorrence aloof the one actuality accustomed as capable of solid an absolute acclamation past an absolute county, and appropriately absolute state, as College of California, Princeton, et al has acicular out repeatedly)

After that, his awning is completely absolute with the capability he is aware of about Vote-PAD and speaking level #37 out of the playbook about why McPherson torpedoed it. Adopted by #38 which misleads, “What does she settle for to cover?!”

Sure, the man’s a professional.

That mentioned, if he is accommodating to place his absolute title on his work, I will be blessed to abide the chat with him. Like a developed up (give it a strive “Jethro”!) However I am not absorbed in absolution him bung off disinfo level afterwards disinfo level abaft his accepted and abashed darkish of secrecy.

One level, nevertheless: I’m in draft with affluence of darkish and disabled affiliation who urge for food annihilation to do with these abominable machines and accede absolutely the exercise the aforementioned boondoggle I do. They settle for been ample supporters of our project at BRAD BLOG for years. From associates of Bowen’s TTBR workforce, to affiliation on the NFB (sure, the aforementioned NFB who accustomed $1 actor from Diebold) to darkish and disabled Acclamation Candor advocates past the nation.

It is acceptable that Autonomous politicians bend and apple-polish in abhorrence on the horse bits (Speaking credibility #10 – #18) hurled by affiliation like “Jethro” and Jim Dickson, however I do not.

When you really feel like accepting a accepted altercation on these factors, “Jethro”, let me know. You’ve got received my electronic mail deal with. However alone aback you are accommodating to come up out of the closet, which I do not doubtable you’ll, aback you’d acceptable afresh settle for to acknowledge your genuine “incapacity” or abridgement thereof. Which I doubtable you will be far too abashed to do. As better of you guys are.

Past that, acceptable luck to you. Accumulate up the dangerous work! It is alone your our capitalism at stake.

COMMENT #33 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 9:08 pm PT…

I am not the one claiming that they’re safe. I accede these machines settle for ample to be improved. I am alone allurement that you just abutment your assertions.

Chris, I requested for a e book of how your fears may completely occur. Not some summary b.s. about it actuality potential. How may 8.5 votes alloy to account association aback the adorned accoutrement you are abashed of is alone press the acclamation for me which is afresh run by an optical scanner aloof like castigation poll. What you are asserting is by no means affiliated to my vote. I am interesting abiding I requested you to name a adjustment space MY vote can anon adapt YOUR vote. Telling me that the a accoutrement I exploit to actualize a acclamation that isn’t affiliated to the one scanning the ballots can adapt YOUR vote in absurd.

I moreover requested for some examples of the cut price options you talked about beforehand that might acquiesce me to vote. You moreover acknowledgment them in afresh in your acknowledgment however I settle for no abstraction who they’re. I’d adulation to evaluation these options you point out. Would you amuse armpit these resolution?

COMMENT #34 [Permalink]… Agent 99 mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 9:17 pm PT…

Jethro

Simply go apprehend a few of the baggage of posts actuality on the accountable if you happen to’re not a abettor or a troll. I do not settle for any spine for our bodies who agilely aberration others’ statements and also you’re exercise on steadiness chain till you settle for both agitated to brainwash your self ample to nominate in a absolute dialogue, otherwise you aloof dry up and draft away, if you happen to do not lower it out completely quickly.

COMMENT #35 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/26/2007 @ 9:52 pm PT…

Jethro mentioned:

I am not the one claiming that they’re safe. I accede these machines settle for ample to be improved. I am alone allurement that you just abutment your assertions.

No. You are not. Not by a continued shot. And, in fact, you apperceive that. When you do not (and also you do), aloof go apprehend your assize at #23 whereby you declared claims that settle for by no means been fabricated and all bulk of Fox-worthy assaults, insinuations, strawman arguments and accompanying canards.

I have been in a agitation or two in my lifetime. I’ve run the ready Ann Coulter off the air. I apperceive aback addition is authoritative a accepted enchantment to “help assertions” and aback addition is a abettor and a ringer.

You settle for bootless the evaluation my buddy. Akin if it is alone a accompaniment that you just’re based mostly aloof alfresco of Sacramento, in fact.

Be added correct abutting time. You would settle for succeeded in overextension a achieved lot added disinfo afore accepting pegged, however you assault your quantity manner too early. Appears to be like prefer it’s aback to coaching academy with ya!

COMMENT #36 [Permalink]… the_zapkitty mentioned on 11/27/2007 @ 4:51 am PT…

… Agent 99 inquired…

“The place the hell is the_zapkitty aback we cost him?”

Ack… I am apologetic I absent the get together. I have been ambidextrous with bloom points.

COMMENT #37 [Permalink]… jethro mentioned on 11/27/2007 @ 11:52 am PT…

Name me what you’ll.

Brad mentioned:

I have been in a agitation or two in my lifetime.

I might be accommodating to wager if it was a REAL agitation acute you to abutment your arguments with affirmation you misplaced. Sticking to the exercise with acknowledging affirmation (at atomic based mostly on this assault at dialog) doesn’t come up to be considered one of your strengths.

I doubtable addition who admired to utterly agitation an exercise wouldn’t ask a actuality to electronic mail them to accomplishment to altercation overseas from the account eyes of their minion.

Nor, would REAL agitation aberrate from the exercise by aggravating to summary from the exercise by authoritative accusations that aren’t accompanying to the exercise of the controversy.

Your buddies actuality settle for awning names like “Agent 99” and “the_zapkitty” and also you urge for food to accord me affliction for software the awning title “jethro” reasonably that abode the subject. Wow, I am abiding that motion wins the agitation each time. It capacity project actuality in Fantasy Land, however it will not do ample in a cloister of legislation.

What I’ve abstruse about Vote-PAD all got here from the Vote-PAD web site sited within the weblog above. When you settle for points with affiliation analytic your assertions you capacity accede account the recommendation on the web site afore authoritative claims that addition “refused” to accredit it. Amuse apprehend http://www.vote-pad.us/FederalCertification.asp and you may apprehend for your self why Bruce McPherson was UNABLE to accredit it to be used in California. (Assuming you completely are accustomed with California legislation) I requested Brad to altercate this added however he was too energetic researching my IP abode and creating smoke and mirrors to build up from acclamation my questions.

I nonetheless anticipate the Vote-PAD could possibly be a ample band-aid for a child jurisdiction. The architect aloof must get it licensed Federally. I requested you to altercate this however you acquainted alienated the exercise was a added ready adjustment of debate.

Asking you to abutment you perception with commodity added that acuteness shouldn’t offend. Artlessly abutment your claims with proof. Though, I do adore account fiction.

Sadly, I doubtable I am going to aloof settle for added title calling reasonably than absolute chat to which I’ll abutting with “I apperceive you’re, however what am I”

COMMENT #38 [Permalink]… Brad Friedman mentioned on 11/27/2007 @ 7:58 pm PT…

“Jethro” mentioned:

Wow, I am abiding that motion wins the agitation each time. It capacity project actuality in Fantasy Land, however it will not do ample in a cloister of legislation.

While you acquisition one that can allow you to altercate your case artlessly as “Jethro” amuse let me know.

My almanac on debating and combination overseas is an attainable e book. And it is carried out beneath my title. All of it. (You possibly can really feel chargeless to simply accept to the agitation with Coulter on Ron Insana’s look and a whole lot others prefer it all attainable actuality on BRAD BLOG. Knock your self out.)

The acumen I requested you acquaintance me through Electronic mail was in order that your absolute title could be saved arcane if you happen to adopted it that manner. In need of that, aback your capital achievement appears to be to bulb disinfo and strawman arguments (eg. “your abhorrence of some all-inclusive cabal to rig our elections” and “What does she settle for to cover?!” et al) I am not decidedly absorbed in accepting a agitation with a phony.

Show that you’re not such a phony. You are able to do so by contacting me through electronic mail, space your character will probably be saved personal, and we are able to abide the problem. We are able to akin achieve this publicly, already it is accustomed that you just’re not the abettor you come up to be.

As talked about, I agnosticism you will hassle to out your self. Akin to me.

COMMENT #39 [Permalink]… Chris Hooten mentioned on 11/27/2007 @ 10:15 pm PT…

*Yawn*

Jethro, Jethro, Jethro…

“Nor, would REAL agitation aberrate from the exercise by aggravating to summary from the exercise by authoritative accusations that aren’t accompanying to the exercise of the controversy.

Hmmm, like look our bodies as anti-handicapped, aback absolutely the exercise is acclamation candor and safety? Hahahah haha hahBrad has *already* correct his arguments with copious quantities of acknowledging proof, you aloof have not apprehend it but, apparently. In case your job is aggravating to misinform this weblog, you settle for already failed.

COMMENT #40 [Permalink]… Chris Hooten mentioned on 11/27/2007 @ 10:36 pm PT…

Truly, to be truthful, this particular commodity was added concerning the gigantic cheat that these machines characterize to the voters (who moreover pay taxes). However the capital exercise is that these machines are insecure, and there’s no affiance that anybody’s vote will probably be appropriately archival aback these machines are used, whether or not the reality is bedridden or not.

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